Health care - thanks for reading this +++ : -) +++
in [Golf]
|
From: dene on 5 Sep 2009 18:54 "Carbon" <nobrac(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message news:4aa27073$0$23978$9a6e19ea(a)unlimited.newshosting.com... > > Now....there is truth regarding medicare rationing, and if you're on > > the short stick of that deal, then perhaps the people who decide this > > could be considered a "death panel." > > Your whole take on it is wrong, I'm assuming not deliberately. There > needs to be some sense injected into the system. If I was in a permanent > vegetative state I would not want to be kept alive like Terry Schaivo. > Would you? Heck no. I probably wouldn't consider chemo unless I was certain it would lead to a cure. These things happen because there is no clear direction about > how to proceed in the event of a catastrophic medical event. Not death > panels, Greg. Saving money by giving people what they want in the first > place. Besides, we already have death panels: http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2009/08/11/denial_of_care/ Your cite is interesting but I betcha there is another side to the story that the author conveniently leaves out. In my own 20+ yr. experience, I've never seen "medically necessary" abused. As for rationing, I'm in favor of it for both MedicAid and Medicare. Oregon was able to receive a waiver which allowed them to ration MedicAid and thus expand coverage to the working poor. This should be done on a national level. Medicare is bloated beyond belief. But...it's a step that might need to happen incrementally. You Canadians were born into a system that rations care. Whereas, Americans are use to having the best, right away, on an unlimited basis. It's going to take a while for rationing or self discipline to take hold. In a private way, this process already is beginning with the advent of Health Savings Accounts. Basically, the employee funds the first $3500 out of a glorified retirement account until the deductible is met. Recently, I met with 40 employees individually, explaining their account, and how it correlates to their deductible. You could see the wheels turning in their heads. No longer are they unconcerned about the price of an MRI, doctor visit, or Rx, since it comes out of their money. That's the kind of voluntary rationing that could work, without gov't intervention. -Greg
From: Jack Hollis on 5 Sep 2009 20:08 On Sat, 5 Sep 2009 15:13:47 -0700, "dene" <dene(a)remove.ipns.com> wrote: >So that's KnitWit's excuse.....that it was written out of context, 32 years >ago. The out of context argument is complete rubbish. What they say is obvious. The only way to describe the person who wrote these things is as an Eco-Fascist. Someone who is willing to suspend democracy, the Constitution and human rights to protect the environment.
From: Howard Brazee on 5 Sep 2009 20:13 On Sat, 5 Sep 2009 15:54:11 -0700, "dene" <dene(a)remove.ipns.com> wrote: >But...it's a step that might need to happen incrementally. You Canadians >were born into a system that rations care. Whereas, Americans are use to >having the best, right away, on an unlimited basis. It's going to take a >while for rationing or self discipline to take hold. Which Americans are used to unlimited paying for our medical care? Every policy I've seen - including Medicare won't pay for just anything. Of course, "reasonable limits" is a moving target. There is no universal agreement on what that means. -- "In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found, than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace to the legislature, and not to the executive department." - James Madison
From: Jack Hollis on 5 Sep 2009 20:11 On Sat, 05 Sep 2009 23:40:47 GMT, Bobby Knight <bknight(a)conramp.net> wrote: >>> I'm sorry BK, but it's you that has to be kidding. These are all >>> entire paragraphs and some are consecutive paragraphs and entire >>> pages. Nothing is taken out of context. >>> > >The context in which it was written was IF a totalitarian government >was to exercise all of these possibilities. Not that the authors >(there were four) were advocating them. Where exactly did you read that? Please cite or .............
From: Carbon on 5 Sep 2009 22:38
On Sat, 05 Sep 2009 15:54:11 -0700, dene wrote: > "Carbon" <nobrac(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message > news:4aa27073$0$23978$9a6e19ea(a)unlimited.newshosting.com... > >> These things happen because there is no clear direction about how to >> proceed in the event of a catastrophic medical event. Not death >> panels, Greg. Saving money by giving people what they want in the >> first place. Besides, we already have death panels: > > http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2009/08/11/denial_of_care/ > > Your cite is interesting but I betcha there is another side to the > story that the author conveniently leaves out. In my own 20+ yr. > experience, I've never seen "medically necessary" abused. > > As for rationing, I'm in favor of it for both MedicAid and Medicare. > Oregon was able to receive a waiver which allowed them to ration > MedicAid and thus expand coverage to the working poor. This should be > done on a national level. Medicare is bloated beyond belief. > > But...it's a step that might need to happen incrementally. You > Canadians were born into a system that rations care. Whereas, > Americans are use to having the best, right away, on an unlimited > basis. It's going to take a while for rationing or self discipline to > take hold. You are in denial. The US system rations care to a *much* greater extent than the Canadian system does. In Canada if you're sick and you need expensive care, you get it, period. No credit checks, no fighting with insurance companies, no paperwork, no bullshit. Here--and you know this--if you get an expensive illness you may not get the care you need, even if you have insurance. Why? Because INSURANCE COMPANIES RATION CARE. This rationing can be based on such non-medical factors as quarterly profits, likelihood of getting away with it, et cetera. Now, I'm not going to google up a thousand more links like the one above, but they're out there. And you know it. |