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From: William Clark on 20 Jan 2010 17:08 In article <911882b2-380f-42f6-aec0-dac3f1519617(a)e16g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>, Dinosaur_Sr <frostback2002(a)att.net> wrote: > On Jan 20, 2:45�pm, Howard Brazee <how...(a)brazee.net> wrote: > > On Wed, 20 Jan 2010 11:37:09 -0800 (PST), Dinosaur Sr > > > > <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > >With respect to reality, about 85% or so of Americans have health > > >insurance, and about that same number, 85% are happy with it. About > > >10% or so can afford health insurance but choose not to buy it, > > >leaving about 5% or so who want the insurance but can't afford it. So > > >how much do we sell out the interests of the 95% for the sake of 5%? > > >If *YOU* want health insurance, *YOU* can buy it. Who else is supposed > > >to pay for your insurance? > > > > Don't forget that the 10% without health insurance get treated anyway > > when they need expensive care, and the hospitals include their costs > > in what they charge the rest of us. > > > So someone gets run over by a bus and we are supposed to leave them > on the street? Or somehow we are going to not send them to an > emergency room? What fraction of that 10% needs such care per year > anyways? It's a very small fraction of the total cost of healthcare, > and no reason to sell out the interests of the 90%. According to Bert, that is exactly what we should do with the injured in Haiti.
From: R&B on 20 Jan 2010 17:09 On 2010-01-20 13:41:54 -0500, Howard Brazee said: > Many times the basic value a person has is Conservativism or > Liberalism. When that's so, we can't argue about whether it is good > or bad for people. That only works when we have other, more basic > values, such as health and happiness. How about life and death? Do you suppose those issues cut across Conservative/Liberal idealogical lines? Fact: Insurance companies today (and every day) deny coverage to people who need health care. Fact: They also (every day) deny payment to cover health care to people who have paid into their health care insurance for years. Fact: They also (every day) cancel people's fully-paid-up policies just because the policyholder commits the sin of getting sick. Fact: They also (every day) refuse to cover people because of pre-existing conditions. Fact: In many of these cases, these decisions to refuse health care benefits have life and death consequences. Fact: Depending on whose estimates you believe, anywhere from 20,000 to 50,000 Americans die each year from a lack of health care coverage. Most of these people would have insurance if (a.) they could afford it, or (b.) they hadn't been denied coverage by insurance companies. If you or I were killing as many people each year as health insurance companies routinely do, we would be on every federal Most Wanted list. And as I said earlier, if Al Queda killed as many Americans each year as health insurance companies do, there would be no end to the funding and resources Americans would be willing to pour into stopping and KILLING them. The health care debate isn't about money, as much as the right would like us to believe. It's about life and death. The right believes it is more "entitled" to life as long as they can AFFORD health care coverage. In other words, they believe the right to life is tied to one's wealth. And they call themselves pro-life. Yeah, right. Keep valuing money over life and you will have a very unpleasant judgment day. Randy
From: Chris Bellomy on 20 Jan 2010 17:17 R&B wrote, On 1/20/10 4:10 PM: > I have no respect for Dene because he shows no one else any respect. He deserves a baseline of consideration for being a fellow human being. This being MLK week, let me remind you: "Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." I'll add that the only time those words have real meaning is when they are uncomfortable and/or difficult. That's where the rubber meets the road. So even when I chastise Dene, I do it out of hope that he'll let go of pettiness and get a sense of perspective. It's a moral imperative to me that I do. YMMV and probably does. cb
From: dene on 20 Jan 2010 17:32 "R&B" <none_of_your_business(a)all.com> wrote in message news:2010012017095816807-noneofyourbusiness(a)allcom... > On 2010-01-20 13:41:54 -0500, Howard Brazee said: > How about life and death? Do you suppose those issues cut across > Conservative/Liberal idealogical lines? > > Fact: Insurance companies today (and every day) deny coverage to > people who need health care. Cite this lie. That has never happened in my 20 years of experience in this business. > Fact: They also (every day) deny payment to cover health care to > people who have paid into their health care insurance for years. Cite this lie. That has never happened in my 20 years of experience in this business. > Fact: They also (every day) cancel people's fully-paid-up policies > just because the policyholder commits the sin of getting sick. Cite this lie. That has never happened in my 20 years of experience in this business. > Fact: They also (every day) refuse to cover people because of > pre-existing conditions. > > Fact: In many of these cases, these decisions to refuse health care > benefits have life and death consequences. Cite this lie. That has never happened in my 20 years of experience in this business. > Fact: Depending on whose estimates you believe, anywhere from 20,000 > to 50,000 Americans die each year from a lack of health care coverage. Cite. > Most of these people would have insurance if (a.) they could afford it, > or (b.) they hadn't been denied coverage by insurance companies. or (c), if it was a priority. > If you or I were killing as many people each year as health insurance > companies routinely do, we would be on every federal Most Wanted list. Leftist bloggist horsemanure > And as I said earlier, if Al Queda killed as many Americans each year > as health insurance companies do, there would be no end to the funding > and resources Americans would be willing to pour into stopping and > KILLING them. More unsubstantiated rhetoric. > The health care debate isn't about money, as much as the right would > like us to believe. > > It's about life and death. More unsubstantiated rhetoric. > The right believes it is more "entitled" to life as long as they can > AFFORD health care coverage. In other words, they believe the right to > life is tied to one's wealth. It's what you do with your wealth. If you are poor, you are eligible for public assistance. Most of the uninsured, including you, choose to be uninsured. > And they call themselves pro-life. Pro-liberty. You have the right to be stupid in this country. > Yeah, right. > > Keep valuing money over life and you will have a very unpleasant judgment day. Further proof of your irrational state of mine. Those who think like you go to heaven. Those who don't deserve hell. Perhaps you should revisit the Scriptures and view the ones which speak of honesty and hatred, then take the log out of your own eye. -Greg
From: dene on 20 Jan 2010 17:37
"Chris Bellomy" <ten.wohsdoog(a)sirhc> wrote in message news:_oednTqscIKbHMrWnZ2dnUVZ_vidnZ2d(a)supernews.com... > R&B wrote, On 1/20/10 4:10 PM: > > > I have no respect for Dene because he shows no one else any respect. > > He deserves a baseline of consideration for being a fellow > human being. This being MLK week, let me remind you: > > "Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do > that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." > > I'll add that the only time those words have real meaning > is when they are uncomfortable and/or difficult. That's > where the rubber meets the road. So even when I chastise > Dene, I do it out of hope that he'll let go of pettiness > and get a sense of perspective. It's a moral imperative > to me that I do. YMMV and probably does. > > cb And since you do it respectfully, sometimes I listen. I follow a simple set of rules in here. If you want to discuss issues, I'm game. Throw in demeaning insults, then I return fire. That practice includes defending people whom I respect. Randy, like a couple of other obtuse bullies in here, hates return fire. -Greg |