Shaft Stiffness and Irons
in [Golf]
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From: Miss Anne Thrope on 9 Feb 2007 08:48 Shaft stiffness. Yeah, as if...
From: Mike Dalecki on 11 Feb 2007 09:46 Dave Lee wrote: > "Mike Dalecki" <mike(a)removeclubdoctor.com> wrote in message > news:531ckaF1qkmtrU2(a)mid.individual.net... >> Dave Lee wrote: >>> I'm toying with the idea of building a new set of irons in the near > future. >>> At the rate that I typically proceed on such things that would mean > calendar >>> 2007 :-) >>> >>> An accepted "golf truism" that I have heard more than once is (roughly) > "the >>> right flex shaft is the most flex that you can control" (where stiffer > means >>> less flex). Particularly with irons I wonder why it really shouldn't be > "the >>> stiffest flex that you can tolerate swinging". >>> >>> I know that I seriously dislike driver shafts with stiff tips. I > honestly >>> don't know if they hit the ball worse for me (or hell - maybe they are >>> better). But I don't like the feel at impact. >>> >>> I don't seem to have that reaction to stiffer iron shafts. And I just > don't >>> see any upside to more flex other than how it feels. The downsides are > more >>> clubhead droop that will vary depending on how hard you swing the club > and >>> similar considerations for the other directions of shaft flex. The > "droop >>> thing" in particular seems to be a real negative to me as it means that > if >>> the lie is right on a full swing then it will almost have to be too > upright >>> for a chip shot. >>> >>> Any comments on this? I recall some discussion on this a while back, but > I >>> recall that it seemed to go off in other directions. Well, of course it > did >>> Dave - this is RSG :-) >>> >>> dave >> Much of the flex question revolves around how you swing a club. The >> most flexible club you can handle tends to assume you have a smooth >> swing; those who load the club fast, and swing fast, tend to need >> stiffer shafts. >> >> To be honest with you, I think the best thing you can do--since you're >> building them yourself--is simply try 2 or 3 variations and see what >> feels the best. Most truisms, like what you quoted above, are >> true--sometimes. >> >> Mike > snip > > Mike, have kind of started a few experiments and will probably do more. > > I'm actually anticipating what to do if the outcome of these experiments is > "I don't seem to have a preference". > > dave > > I'll bet you do have a preference. You may find that you can make all the variations work--if you swing them properly. But one will feel the most comfortable to you. I've noticed this with my own clubs (experimenting w/ drivers and shafts). I *can* make a stiff shaft perform in the driver--and in fact, I can produce some pretty good results with it, good distance. But I have to jump on it to get it to load and unload at the right time. But that's not what I'm swinging. I want something more flexible, because I'm trying to get the same swing with the woods as I use with the irons. The last year or so, a lot of my practice has been focusing on lag, and I have a very difficult time maintaining that if I have to swing quickly--too easy for me to come over the top. So something that responds better to my lag, and even requires me to wait a bit for the club, works better for me. When you experiment, make sure you have some pretty significant differences at the margins, at least at the beginning. Don't, for instance, tip 1/4" more shaft and expect you'll find a major difference you can feel. If it were me, I'd try to define a shaft that was too stiff, and one that was too flexible. Then I'd define the point between them where i didn't have to work to make the club perform. Mike -- Mike Dalecki GCA Accredited Clubmaker http://clubdoctor.com RSG-Wisconsin 2007: June 22-24----Lawsonia!
From: Dave Lee on 11 Feb 2007 13:34 "Mike Dalecki" <mike(a)removeclubdoctor.com> wrote in message news:538oirF1qnts4U1(a)mid.individual.net... > > I'll bet you do have a preference. You may find that you can make all > the variations work--if you swing them properly. > > But one will feel the most comfortable to you. > > I've noticed this with my own clubs (experimenting w/ drivers and > shafts). I *can* make a stiff shaft perform in the driver--and in fact, > I can produce some pretty good results with it, good distance. But I > have to jump on it to get it to load and unload at the right time. > > But that's not what I'm swinging. I want something more flexible, > because I'm trying to get the same swing with the woods as I use with > the irons. The last year or so, a lot of my practice has been focusing > on lag, and I have a very difficult time maintaining that if I have to > swing quickly--too easy for me to come over the top. > > So something that responds better to my lag, and even requires me to > wait a bit for the club, works better for me. > > When you experiment, make sure you have some pretty significant > differences at the margins, at least at the beginning. Don't, for > instance, tip 1/4" more shaft and expect you'll find a major difference > you can feel. > > If it were me, I'd try to define a shaft that was too stiff, and one > that was too flexible. Then I'd define the point between them where i > didn't have to work to make the club perform. > > Mike snip Mike, that is good advice and probably something that I will do. But I do find it surprising that on a side-by-side test of the same clubheads - one on an A flex shaft (37 7/8" at 295 cpm) and an identical clubhead on a stock Hogan #4 (stiff) shaft - I don't really seem to have a preference. However, my lag is not that good and it really may not matter much. dave
From: Dave Lee on 11 Feb 2007 13:35 "Dave Lee" <DaveLeeNC(a)ix.netcom.RemovE.com> wrote in message news:QkJzh.385$tD2.80(a)newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net... > > "Mike Dalecki" <mike(a)removeclubdoctor.com> wrote in message > news:538oirF1qnts4U1(a)mid.individual.net... > > > > > I'll bet you do have a preference. You may find that you can make all > > the variations work--if you swing them properly. > > > > But one will feel the most comfortable to you. > > > > I've noticed this with my own clubs (experimenting w/ drivers and > > shafts). I *can* make a stiff shaft perform in the driver--and in fact, > > I can produce some pretty good results with it, good distance. But I > > have to jump on it to get it to load and unload at the right time. > > > > But that's not what I'm swinging. I want something more flexible, > > because I'm trying to get the same swing with the woods as I use with > > the irons. The last year or so, a lot of my practice has been focusing > > on lag, and I have a very difficult time maintaining that if I have to > > swing quickly--too easy for me to come over the top. > > > > So something that responds better to my lag, and even requires me to > > wait a bit for the club, works better for me. > > > > When you experiment, make sure you have some pretty significant > > differences at the margins, at least at the beginning. Don't, for > > instance, tip 1/4" more shaft and expect you'll find a major difference > > you can feel. > > > > If it were me, I'd try to define a shaft that was too stiff, and one > > that was too flexible. Then I'd define the point between them where i > > didn't have to work to make the club perform. > > > > Mike > snip > > Mike, that is good advice and probably something that I will do. > > But I do find it surprising that on a side-by-side test of the same > clubheads - one on an A flex shaft (37 7/8" at 295 cpm) and an identical > clubhead on a stock Hogan #4 (stiff) shaft - I don't really seem to have a > preference. > > However, my lag is not that good and it really may not matter much. > > dave > As a final comment. I seem to be pretty picky when it comes to drivers. Go figure. dave
From: Mike Dalecki on 11 Feb 2007 16:56
Dave Lee wrote: > "Mike Dalecki" <mike(a)removeclubdoctor.com> wrote in message > news:538oirF1qnts4U1(a)mid.individual.net... > >> I'll bet you do have a preference. You may find that you can make all >> the variations work--if you swing them properly. >> >> But one will feel the most comfortable to you. >> >> I've noticed this with my own clubs (experimenting w/ drivers and >> shafts). I *can* make a stiff shaft perform in the driver--and in fact, >> I can produce some pretty good results with it, good distance. But I >> have to jump on it to get it to load and unload at the right time. >> >> But that's not what I'm swinging. I want something more flexible, >> because I'm trying to get the same swing with the woods as I use with >> the irons. The last year or so, a lot of my practice has been focusing >> on lag, and I have a very difficult time maintaining that if I have to >> swing quickly--too easy for me to come over the top. >> >> So something that responds better to my lag, and even requires me to >> wait a bit for the club, works better for me. >> >> When you experiment, make sure you have some pretty significant >> differences at the margins, at least at the beginning. Don't, for >> instance, tip 1/4" more shaft and expect you'll find a major difference >> you can feel. >> >> If it were me, I'd try to define a shaft that was too stiff, and one >> that was too flexible. Then I'd define the point between them where i >> didn't have to work to make the club perform. >> >> Mike > snip > > Mike, that is good advice and probably something that I will do. > > But I do find it surprising that on a side-by-side test of the same > clubheads - one on an A flex shaft (37 7/8" at 295 cpm) and an identical > clubhead on a stock Hogan #4 (stiff) shaft - I don't really seem to have a > preference. > > However, my lag is not that good and it really may not matter much. > > dave > > Have you spec'd the hogan stiff shaft? I could tell you stories.... Mike -- Mike Dalecki GCA Accredited Clubmaker http://clubdoctor.com RSG-Wisconsin 2007: June 22-24----Lawsonia! |