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From: Alan Baker on 5 Feb 2010 22:43
In article <7plpm5hag07k1ehdn7n84rg5ms8cius4vq(a)4ax.com>,
David Laville <dlaville(a)nospam.net> wrote:

> On Fri, 05 Feb 2010 12:54:20 -0800, Alan Baker <alangbaker(a)telus.net>
> wrote:
>
> >I tried it, and it was useful to me for only a short while.
> >
> >For me, I'd always had trouble making good contact. I was too much a
> >picker of the ball and if I was off on a shot, the results were both
> >skulls and chunks.
>
> Wow, this is truly amazing! When you posted a link to your swing vid
> and I looked at it I said you had clubhead throwaway and were
> susceptible to hitting fat shots. Remember what you told me? I was
> wrong, didn't know what I was talking about and that you didn't hit
> the ball fat. In fact you boasted about your contact.
>
> Thanks for proving me right and that you're a liar.

That video was from after my days of S&T. I don't have a problem with
hitting fat anymore.

>
> >So I tried S&T;
>
> Why? You told me how sound and mechanically correct your swing was.
> Why try to change something you claimed to do correctly?

You're imagining a sequence of events that doesn't exist.

>
> > thinking that if I didn't move
> >laterally during the swing, it would improve my chances of arriving back
> >to impact with the clubhead in the correct position.
>
> Wait, let me try to grasp this.....your mechanically correct swing had
> a lateral move? Surely if this lateral move was in your mechanically
> correct swing than it must have been correct as well, right?

Again: you're imagining a sequence that doesn't exist.

>
> >And it did give me that. But I could never get as comfortable with it
> >for the long irons and not at all with the woods -- particularly off the
> >tee. So for a brief while, it was S&T with the short to mid irons, and
> >conventional swings with the woods (and mostly hope not to need to hit a
> >long iron). This wasn't really a stable balance. :-)
>
> So you, Mr. Know It All, the man who thinks he's smarter than everyone
> else in the world about everything, including the golf swing, thought
> the solution was to play with two golf swings instead of one? It's
> hard enough to learn one golf swing why try to learn and play with two
> if you don't even have the first one half way mastered?

No. I didn't think that. As I just said.

>
> >Now I make much better contact with my swing without any S&T at
> >all.
>
> So Mr. Know It All had to experience something to know it didn't work
> while I was able to use knowledge alone to know it didn't work.

LOL

Only by imagining the our conversation about my swing video preceded my
experience with S&T can you make any of this appear true to you.

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
<http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg>
From: Alan Baker on 5 Feb 2010 22:43
In article
<dca75d62-93b1-45c9-b531-f7c6b36b1a52(a)k18g2000prf.googlegroups.com>,
dugjustdug <prestigerealty(a)yvn.com> wrote:

> On Feb 5, 12:54�pm, Alan Baker <alangba...(a)telus.net> wrote:
> > For me, I'd always had trouble making good contact. I was too much a
> > picker of the ball and if I was off on a shot, the results were both
> > skulls and chunks. So I tried S&T; thinking that if I didn't move
> > laterally during the swing, it would improve my chances of arriving back
> > to impact with the clubhead in the correct position.
>
> Alan - I wonder if that was partly a function of the soggier turf you
> regularly play. I would have nothing but trouble playing coastal
> courses because I was used to getting a bit of bounce from the turf.
> (I, too, am a picker/sweeper of the ball.)

I wish I could lay it off on that, DJD, I really do...

....but I think in my case it was that -- having essentially picked up
the game without any lessons at all -- I had that common misconception
that to get the ball in the air the clubhead should be going up (or at
least, not down) at impact. And as much as my head knew that that wasn't
the case, it took a complete shakeup of my technique to let me really
*feel* what impact should be like.

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
<http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg>
From: Alan Baker on 5 Feb 2010 22:45
In article <ahlpm5lkg8u5tstasfv85gf8afbgh57pku(a)4ax.com>,
Loudon Briggs <larebe(a)bbz.net> wrote:

> dugjustdug <prestigerealty(a)yvn.com> wrote:
>
> >On Feb 5, 12:54�pm, Alan Baker <alangba...(a)telus.net> wrote:
> >> For me, I'd always had trouble making good contact. I was too much a
> >> picker of the ball and if I was off on a shot, the results were both
> >> skulls and chunks. So I tried S&T; thinking that if I didn't move
> >> laterally during the swing, it would improve my chances of arriving back
> >> to impact with the clubhead in the correct position.
> >
> >Alan - I wonder if that was partly a function of the soggier turf you
> >regularly play. I would have nothing but trouble playing coastal
> >courses because I was used to getting a bit of bounce from the turf.
> >(I, too, am a picker/sweeper of the ball.)
> >
> >Don - I could see where the agressive Ball First nature of S&T would
> >work very well if you have a case of the fatties like I regularly do
> >when I first play mushier courses. Like Alan closed with - find would
> >works with the swing that brung ya.
> >
> >(Take that, Loudon! :-P)
>
> With Alan giving a positive answer too, I AM slightly chastened! :)

Rightly so, too!

;-)

> --
>
> Loudon R. Briggs larebe(a)bbz.net Phoenix, AZ
>
> "How Can You Not Like A Game Where It's Okay To
> Get Teed Off, Tote A Six-Iron, Shoot Birdies,
> and If You're Under Par It's A Great Day!"
>
> (from "Frank & Ernest" by Bob Thaves -- used with permission)

P.S. if you put a space after the dashes ("-- ") your sig will be
automatically removed by properly designed news clients.

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
<http://gallery.me.com/alangbaker/100008/DSCF0162/web.jpg>
From: Loudon Briggs on 5 Feb 2010 23:01
David Laville <dlaville(a)nospam.net> wrote:
(clip)

>
>There is one golf swing that works, has always worked and will always
>work. It's called "the basic golf swing". If you build your swing
>around the basics it will never fall apart like all these magic swing
>methods do.
>
>I'm an authorized instructor of The Golfing Machine and knowing the 24
>components of the golf swing and their variations I can teach you to
>swing the club over a millions ways. None of them are better than the
>basic golf swing.
>
>David Laville G.S.E.M.
>The Golfing Machine Authorized Instructor
************************

David,I'm totally in agreement with your basic statement!

When I was first being taught, over 80 years ago, my Grandfather used
a "basic" system too, though it only consisted of about six or eight
segments, not twenty four. He probably realized that a 7 year old
could not keep more than that in his head. What he DID do was
concentrate on no more than one or two at a session, usually just
one... over and over. Little by little, as he became satisfied with my
performance of each segment, he began to combine them until I had a
swing that consisted of ALL those segments, and HE was satisfied with
my complete (basic) swing.

Once that was accomplished, he told me that anytime that I was having
a problem I thought could be attributed to 'my swing,' I was to
concentrate on any one of the segments we had tried to perfect during
my instruction. When I was satisfied that I was doing that one segment
right, muscle memory would take over and the other segments would fall
into place. I played until about 9 years ago, and that advice never
failed me. I was a recreational golfer but a pretty good one. I found
his advice would even work during a round... pick a segment and
concentrate... muscle memory!

For that to work you probably need a pro initially... someone to
instruct and watch you carefully. Whatever number of segments or
components he uses, six or twenty four, HE has to be satisfied with
each segment AND the complete swing.


--

Loudon R. Briggs larebe(a)bbz.net Phoenix, AZ

"How Can You Not Like A Game Where It's Okay To
Get Teed Off, Tote A Six-Iron, Shoot Birdies,
and If You're Under Par It's A Great Day!"

(from "Frank & Ernest" by Bob Thaves -- used with permission)
From: Don A Roof on 6 Feb 2010 06:08
Alan Baker wrote:

"...I could never get as comfortable with it [stack and tilt] for the
long irons and not at all with the woods -- particularly off the
tee...."

________________________________

I haven't tried it yet but I had the feeling in reading about the swing
that hitting a driver would be difficult. The authors also seem to see
that there is a difficulty in using the swing for longer clubs because
they address the issue in what seems to be the same disclaimer mode
they use in assuring the reader that the "reverse pivot" is not a
problem with the swing.

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