The BP debacle (was: Need a job??)
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From: Moderate on 7 Jun 2010 10:59 "William Clark" <clark(a)nospam.matsceng.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message news:clark-3FBB6B.09561607062010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu... > In article <huisfl$2k0$1(a)speranza.aioe.org>, > "Moderate" <no_spam_(a)no_mail.com> wrote: > >> "William Clark" <clark(a)nospam.matsceng.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message >> news:clark-34AD14.07500807062010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu... >> > In article <64bo069mdphbgnd29qml1s0m8jshnojoaq(a)4ax.com>, >> > Jack Hollis <xsleeper(a)aol.com> wrote: >> > >> >> On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 15:26:50 -0500, bknight(a)conramp.net wrote: >> >> >> >> >>But Katrina was an act of God. The oil spill was caused by BP and >> >> >>they're Obama's biggest campaign contributor. >> >> > >> >> >How, in any way, does that make Obama or the government accountable >> >> >for cleaning up BP's mess? >> >> >> >> The blame for this mess will be shared by BP and Obama. When you're >> >> in charge, there's no way to avoid blame. It's not fair, but that's >> >> the way it is. >> > >> > "In charge" of what? There is only one entity here "in charge" of oil >> > drilling (and spreading lies and misinformation), and it is not Obama. >> >> I guess the Department of the Interior does not count. > > You mean like you do not think? I win.
From: William Clark on 7 Jun 2010 14:03 In article <huj1hd$bmc$1(a)speranza.aioe.org>, "Moderate" <no_spam_(a)no_mail.com> wrote: > "William Clark" <clark(a)nospam.matsceng.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message > news:clark-3FBB6B.09561607062010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu... > > In article <huisfl$2k0$1(a)speranza.aioe.org>, > > "Moderate" <no_spam_(a)no_mail.com> wrote: > > > >> "William Clark" <clark(a)nospam.matsceng.ohio-state.edu> wrote in message > >> news:clark-34AD14.07500807062010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu... > >> > In article <64bo069mdphbgnd29qml1s0m8jshnojoaq(a)4ax.com>, > >> > Jack Hollis <xsleeper(a)aol.com> wrote: > >> > > >> >> On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 15:26:50 -0500, bknight(a)conramp.net wrote: > >> >> > >> >> >>But Katrina was an act of God. The oil spill was caused by BP and > >> >> >>they're Obama's biggest campaign contributor. > >> >> > > >> >> >How, in any way, does that make Obama or the government accountable > >> >> >for cleaning up BP's mess? > >> >> > >> >> The blame for this mess will be shared by BP and Obama. When you're > >> >> in charge, there's no way to avoid blame. It's not fair, but that's > >> >> the way it is. > >> > > >> > "In charge" of what? There is only one entity here "in charge" of oil > >> > drilling (and spreading lies and misinformation), and it is not Obama. > >> > >> I guess the Department of the Interior does not count. > > > > You mean like you do not think? > > I win. Au contraire, you simply prove my point emphatically.
From: John B. on 7 Jun 2010 14:25 On Jun 7, 6:55 am, Moderate <nos...(a)nomail.com> wrote: > "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > On Jun 6, 3:05 pm, Jack Hollis <xslee...(a)aol.com> wrote: > > > On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 10:34:22 -0500, bkni...(a)conramp.net wrote: > > > >Even though Katrina happened during the Bush administration he's > > > > not > > > >the blame , even though the buck stops there. FEMA was just not > > > >ready, and then mismanaged. > > > > >In neither case was the government, nor the President, the > > > > underlying > > > >cause of the incident. > > > > FIMA had responded quite well to every previous hurricane. The > > > problem in NO was they had to deal with totally incompetent state > > > and > > > local officials. > > > > In any case, Bush got the blame even though, as you say, he had > > > nothing to do with it. Unfortunately for Obama, he will also get > > > the > > > blame for the failures of the Gulf oil leak. And it looks like this > > > is going to go on for a long time. > > > FEMA had responded well to previous hurricanes because it was staffed > > with people with experience and expertise in emergency management, > > e.g. Jamie Lee Whitt. Bush turned it into a dumping ground for > > political pals and people who had worked on his campaign. "Brownie" > > had zero - repeat: zero - background in emergency services. Even if > > they had known what they were doing, it's kind of ridiculous to > > suggest that the incompetence of local officials kept them from being > > able to do their job. > > Check your facts. Katrina was the largest and fastest response in > history. What does "largest and fastest" mean? The most people? How fast they got there? Even if you're right (which you can't prove), what matters is what they did after they got there -- which is screw things up every which way from Tuesday. And not just in the initial response, but for months afterward.
From: Moderate on 7 Jun 2010 14:59 "John B." <johnb505(a)gmail.com> wrote in message news:c2ddee73-bd22-43a6-8faa-7e784e69ad74(a)j4g2000yqh.googlegroups.com... On Jun 7, 6:55 am, Moderate <nos...(a)nomail.com> wrote: > "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > On Jun 6, 3:05 pm, Jack Hollis <xslee...(a)aol.com> wrote: > > > On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 10:34:22 -0500, bkni...(a)conramp.net wrote: > > > >Even though Katrina happened during the Bush administration he's > > > > not > > > >the blame , even though the buck stops there. FEMA was just not > > > >ready, and then mismanaged. > > > > >In neither case was the government, nor the President, the > > > > underlying > > > >cause of the incident. > > > > FIMA had responded quite well to every previous hurricane. The > > > problem in NO was they had to deal with totally incompetent state > > > and > > > local officials. > > > > In any case, Bush got the blame even though, as you say, he had > > > nothing to do with it. Unfortunately for Obama, he will also get > > > the > > > blame for the failures of the Gulf oil leak. And it looks like this > > > is going to go on for a long time. > > > FEMA had responded well to previous hurricanes because it was staffed > > with people with experience and expertise in emergency management, > > e.g. Jamie Lee Whitt. Bush turned it into a dumping ground for > > political pals and people who had worked on his campaign. "Brownie" > > had zero - repeat: zero - background in emergency services. Even if > > they had known what they were doing, it's kind of ridiculous to > > suggest that the incompetence of local officials kept them from being > > able to do their job. > > Check your facts. Katrina was the largest and fastest response in > history. What does "largest and fastest" mean? The most people? How fast they got there? Even if you're right (which you can't prove), what matters is what they did after they got there -- which is screw things up every which way from Tuesday. And not just in the initial response, but for months afterward. ********************************************************** There were 100,000 emergency personnel on the scene in three days. Helicopter rescues started two hours after the hurricane hit.
From: bknight on 7 Jun 2010 15:09
On Mon, 7 Jun 2010 13:59:49 -0500, "Moderate" <no_spam_(a)no_mail.com> wrote: > >"John B." <johnb505(a)gmail.com> wrote in message >news:c2ddee73-bd22-43a6-8faa-7e784e69ad74(a)j4g2000yqh.googlegroups.com... >On Jun 7, 6:55 am, Moderate <nos...(a)nomail.com> wrote: >> "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> > On Jun 6, 3:05 pm, Jack Hollis <xslee...(a)aol.com> wrote: >> > > On Sun, 06 Jun 2010 10:34:22 -0500, bkni...(a)conramp.net wrote: >> > > >Even though Katrina happened during the Bush administration he's >> > > > not >> > > >the blame , even though the buck stops there. FEMA was just not >> > > >ready, and then mismanaged. >> >> > > >In neither case was the government, nor the President, the >> > > > underlying >> > > >cause of the incident. >> >> > > FIMA had responded quite well to every previous hurricane. The >> > > problem in NO was they had to deal with totally incompetent state >> > > and >> > > local officials. >> >> > > In any case, Bush got the blame even though, as you say, he had >> > > nothing to do with it. Unfortunately for Obama, he will also get >> > > the >> > > blame for the failures of the Gulf oil leak. And it looks like this >> > > is going to go on for a long time. >> >> > FEMA had responded well to previous hurricanes because it was staffed >> > with people with experience and expertise in emergency management, >> > e.g. Jamie Lee Whitt. Bush turned it into a dumping ground for >> > political pals and people who had worked on his campaign. "Brownie" >> > had zero - repeat: zero - background in emergency services. Even if >> > they had known what they were doing, it's kind of ridiculous to >> > suggest that the incompetence of local officials kept them from being >> > able to do their job. >> >> Check your facts. Katrina was the largest and fastest response in >> history. > >What does "largest and fastest" mean? The most people? How fast they >got there? Even if you're right (which you can't prove), what matters >is what they did after they got there -- which is screw things up >every which way from Tuesday. And not just in the initial response, >but for months afterward. >********************************************************** > >There were 100,000 emergency personnel on the scene in three days. >Helicopter rescues started two hours after the hurricane hit. > It didn't make any difference. FEMA could've been there, waiting, before the hurricane hit. They were inept, so what did being there large and fast mean? Nothing. More empty rhetoric. BK |