From: dene on

"BAR" <screw(a)you.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.262b91d2dd904519989dcc(a)news.giganews.com...
> In article <82cuhcF4t8U1(a)mid.individual.net>, dene(a)remove.ipns.com
> says...
> >
> > Nope. People should buy their own insurance. Why should health
> > insurance be different than any other form of insurance?
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > How do you propose to motivate healthy people to buy their own health
> > insurance?
>
> What motivation is there for healthy people to buy their own life
> insurance?

Love is the primary reason people buy life insurance.

Protection of assets and assurance of complete medicare care is why people
buy health insurance. Trouble is....30 million people choose to roll the
dice, including my 26 year old daughter. Unless the entitlement of free ER
care is removed, then a system has to be established to force 30 million
people to join up and start paying their way. That's the cure and it will
only work if there is a carrot and stick. The Republican plans only had
carrots.

-Greg


From: dene on

"Dinosaur_Sr" <frostback(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote in message
news:cb0c94bc-0d50-47dc-a822-4494480eca9d(a)h27g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
On Apr 10, 11:42 pm, "dene" <d...(a)remove.ipns.com> wrote:
> "Dinosaur_Sr" <frostb...(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote in message
>
> news:e7aac200-720c-4b5b-a9ae-aecb9d9dfaaa(a)x12g2000yqx.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 10, 4:31 pm, "Kommienezuspadt" <NoS...(a)NoWay.com> wrote:
>
> > "Dinosaur_Sr" <frostb...(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:0ffe4436-5f36-430d-8832-21372dc1f572(a)b33g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
> > On Apr 9, 5:27 pm, "Kommienezuspadt" <NoS...(a)NoThanks.net> wrote:
>
> > > "Dinosaur_Sr" <frostb...(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote in message
>
> >
>news:db82085e-9774-4cc7-8569-bed8104d1ed0(a)g11g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
> > > On Apr 7, 7:27 pm, "Kommienezuspadt" <NoS...(a)NoThanks.net> wrote:
>
> > > > "BAR" <sc...(a)you.com> wrote in message
>
> > > >news:MPG.2626db0beecff47c989db5(a)news.giganews.com...
>
> > > > > In article <yP6vn.306035$OX4.117...(a)newsfe25.iad>,
>
> NoS...(a)NoThanks.net
>
>
>
> > > > > says...
> > > > >> The nature of the "loophole" doesn't alter the fact that it
> > > > >> represents
> > > > >> billions in revenue for the various companies. IT was a reduction
> in
> > > > >> the expense associated with a specific benefit, whose expressed
> > > > >> purpose was to sustain the benefit. Now that the loophole is
gone,
> > > > >> the
> > > > >> benefit too will go.
>
> > > > >> My understanding is that this particular thing was associated
with
> > > > >> the
> > > > >> Bush administrations free drugs for seniors program, and this
> program
> > > > >> saved them money by maintaining a class of seniors who got their
> drug
> > > > >> money from another source...it was/is apparently cheaper this way
> > > > >> than
> > > > >> having the govt directly subsidize the seniors.
>
> > > > >> This will pull billions from salary expenses from various
> businesses
> > > > >> and cannot have any other effect than reducing jobs and/or
> benefits,
> > > > >> depending on how they want to make up the revenue shortfall.
>
> > > > >> ===
> > > > >> It was a gift to the large companies that has been closed --
simple
> > > > >> as
> > > > >> that -- maybe YOU like handing over $$ & then letting them write
it
> > > > >> off
> > > > >> as
> > > > >> an expense --- if so - you must be a give it away & borrow type
>
> > > > > Tax policy should encourage employment rather than discourage
> > > > > employment. Screwing the big companies only results in screwing
the
> > > > > "worker", the guy Obama says he is trying to help.
>
> > > > > How many people were hired by the poor today?
>
> > > > Let's give AT&T all of your money then.
>
> > > I can choose to purchase a product from ATT or not. I cannot choose my
> > > health insurance though.
>
> > > ===
>
> > > true -- but YOU said they were being screwed by them not being able to
> > > write
> > > off a huge gift to them -- I'm still shaking my head on how you can
> think
> > > that is a good idea - but you'll howl about paying for insurance with
> tax
> > > money.
>
> > I never said the companies were being screwed, just that the
> > elimination of the policy will cost them money, and it will, and that
> > it is salary money that they will loose. These are simple facts, and
> > it is not too difficult to extrapolate the consequences.
>
> > I agree with you that it is and was a dumb policy.
>
> > ===
>
> > I stand corrected -- it was BAR who said it was screwing them --
>
> > Still -- you are saying that we should give them $$ to buy insurance --
> but
> > not regular people --- How can you defend giving money away & then
defend
> > not giving it for the same end result?
>
> > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
>
> signature database 5016 (20100410) __________
>
>
>
> > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> >http://www.eset.com
>
> Nope. People should buy their own insurance. Why should health
> insurance be different than any other form of insurance?
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>
> How do you propose to motivate healthy people to buy their own health
> insurance?
>
> -Greg

It's called freedom. They can buy or not, and face the music they
compose.

----------------------------------------------------------------

So you are in favor of removing free ER care, correct?

-Greg


From: bknight on
On Mon, 12 Apr 2010 10:35:19 -0700, "dene" <dene(a)remove.ipns.com>
wrote:

>
>"Dinosaur_Sr" <frostback(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote in message

>> > Or how about you get
>> > what you can earn...and the govt helps out people in legitimate
>> > need...but no universality to any entitlement.
>>
>> > -----------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> > That's the system in place now, Rob. Part D is not an entitlement. It's
>> > VOLUNTARY. For example, BK chose to not enroll and that's his right. He
>> > will be penalized if he enrolls later.

Isn't Part D going away in the future?

>
>I have no choice, and you know it. I have to pay into medicare, even
>though I am convinced there will be nothing left of it when I retire.
>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------
>
>And when it's time to collect, you will.
>
>-Greg
>

Sure he will, but in the meantime it seems that he doesn't like other
people collecting.

Seriously Greg, I appreciate your trying to educate some of the ultra
rights like Bert and Rob about the healthcare situation. It shows
that you don't just do the ovine tap dance as they do.

BK
From: William Clark on
In article <MPG.262ccfa9b232c074989dd9(a)news.giganews.com>,
BAR <screw(a)you.com> wrote:

> In article <wclark2-D7DE67.21433311042010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-
> state.edu>, wclark2(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com says...
> >
> > In article
> > <f5060e6a-72f0-4146-8c87-bdee116e9d7a(a)35g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>,
> > Dinosaur_Sr <frostback(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Apr 11, 8:09�pm, William Clark <wcla...(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > > In article <MPG.262c27fef07c901b989...(a)news.giganews.com>,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > �BAR <sc...(a)you.com> wrote:
> > > > > In article <45d14ed4-d005-4e38-bd4d-
> > > > > 00a2fec1e...(a)c1g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>, johnb...(a)gmail.com says...
> > > >
> > > > > > > Why don't they just buy their own meds? What % of the population
> > > > > > > can't
> > > > > > > buy their own meds? How many people with golf memberships have
> > > > > > > their
> > > > > > > meds discounted via a govt program?...for what...to give the
> > > > > > > recipients enough free cash to have a golf memberships? In the
> > > > > > > mean
> > > > > > > time unemployment for young people is 20%, and if they get a job
> > > > > > > 1/2
> > > > > > > of what they make goes to someone else. How much goes to either
> > > > > > > deadbeats or people who have far more assets than the young
> > > > > > > person?
> > > >
> > > > > > A substantial percentage of Americans can't buy their own meds,
> > > > > > including me. I take three prescription drugs. My wife takes three.
> > > > > > If
> > > > > > we had to pay for them ourselves it would cost several thousand
> > > > > > dollars a month. Your ignorance of how people live is utterly
> > > > > > amazing.
> > > >
> > > > > Is it society's fault that you and your wife's health is screwed up?
> > > > > No.
> > > >
> > > > > You could stop playing golf. You could stop high speed Internet. You
> > > > > could stop cable TV. You could going out to eat luch and dinner. You
> > > > > could stop your cell phones.
> > > >
> > > > > There are many things you could do to rearange your finances so that
> > > > > you
> > > > > can pay for your own drugs rather than brudening your friends,
> > > > > neighbors, and fellow citizens to support your health and life style.
> > > >
> > > > John, why don't you do as Bert says, and just go out, lie down in the
> > > > street, and die? That would save him from the appalling possibility of
> > > > ever having to do the right thing for any human being other than
> > > > himself.
> > >
> > > Taking other people's resources to solve your problems is not selfish?
> > > Why can't you use your resources to solve your problems? We can help
> > > the poor, but that is another issue.
> >
> > Alternatively, why can't I use my resources to help others? I know this
> > is a terrible anti-Fox notion, but some people actually feel that it is
> > the right thing to do. Obviously not you and Bertie.
>
> Billy, I have told you numerous times that you are free to set up a
> charity and solicit money from others who think and believe like you.
> You will then be free to redistribute that money to your hearts desire
> to help those you believe need help. This can be accomplished without
> any government intervention.
>
> The problem you will soon find is that those who think and believe like
> you are unwilling to part with their own money. These believers want to
> implement schemes and laws that force those who disagree with them to be
> compelled to part with their money to fund the believers causes.

Then why is it unreasonable to expect others to do their part to help
the less fortunate? The colective will far surpasses individual efforts.
I would rather do that than have my money going to subsidize your
childrens' education, for example, as it does now, but you don't seem to
have a problem with forcing others to pay for that.
From: William Clark on
In article
<949b5901-8468-443a-946d-18bf7314d0c4(a)x3g2000yqd.googlegroups.com>,
"John B." <johnb505(a)gmail.com> wrote:

> On Apr 12, 7:35�am, BAR <sc...(a)you.com> wrote:
> > In article <wclark2-D7DE67.21433311042...(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-
> > state.edu>, wcla...(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com says...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > In article
> > > <f5060e6a-72f0-4146-8c87-bdee116e9...(a)35g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>,
> > > �Dinosaur Sr <frostb...(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote:
> >
> > > > On Apr 11, 8:09�pm, William Clark <wcla...(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > In article <MPG.262c27fef07c901b989...(a)news.giganews.com>,
> >
> > > > > �BAR <sc...(a)you.com> wrote:
> > > > > > In article <45d14ed4-d005-4e38-bd4d-
> > > > > > 00a2fec1e...(a)c1g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>, johnb...(a)gmail.com
> > > > > > says...
> >
> > > > > > > > Why don't they just buy their own meds? What % of the
> > > > > > > > population can't
> > > > > > > > buy their own meds? How many people with golf memberships have
> > > > > > > > their
> > > > > > > > meds discounted via a govt program?...for what...to give the
> > > > > > > > recipients enough free cash to have a golf memberships? In the
> > > > > > > > mean
> > > > > > > > time unemployment for young people is 20%, and if they get a
> > > > > > > > job 1/2
> > > > > > > > of what they make goes to someone else. How much goes to either
> > > > > > > > deadbeats or people who have far more assets than the young
> > > > > > > > person?
> >
> > > > > > > A substantial percentage of Americans can't buy their own meds,
> > > > > > > including me. I take three prescription drugs. My wife takes
> > > > > > > three. If
> > > > > > > we had to pay for them ourselves it would cost several thousand
> > > > > > > dollars a month. Your ignorance of how people live is utterly
> > > > > > > amazing.
> >
> > > > > > Is it society's fault that you and your wife's health is screwed
> > > > > > up? No.
> >
> > > > > > You could stop playing golf. You could stop high speed Internet.
> > > > > > You
> > > > > > could stop cable TV. You could going out to eat luch and dinner.
> > > > > > You
> > > > > > could stop your cell phones.
> >
> > > > > > There are many things you could do to rearange your finances so
> > > > > > that you
> > > > > > can pay for your own drugs rather than brudening your friends,
> > > > > > neighbors, and fellow citizens to support your health and life
> > > > > > style.
> >
> > > > > John, why don't you do as Bert says, and just go out, lie down in the
> > > > > street, and die? That would save him from the appalling possibility
> > > > > of
> > > > > ever having to do the right thing for any human being other than
> > > > > himself.
> >
> > > > Taking other people's resources to solve your problems is not selfish?
> > > > Why can't you use your resources to solve your problems? We can help
> > > > the poor, but that is another issue.
> >
> > > Alternatively, why can't I use my resources to help others? I know this
> > > is a terrible anti-Fox notion, but some people actually feel that it is
> > > the right thing to do. Obviously not you and Bertie.
> >
> > Billy, I have told you numerous times that you are free to set up a
> > charity and solicit money from others who think and believe like you.
> > You will then be free to redistribute that money to your hearts desire
> > to help those you believe need help. This can be accomplished without
> > any government intervention.
> >
> > The problem you will soon find is that those who think and believe like
> > you are unwilling to part with their own money. These believers want to
> > implement schemes and laws that force those who disagree with them to be
> > compelled to part with their money to fund the believers causes.- Hide
> > quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> And those who think and believe like you represent about 0.00000001%
> of the population. But I guess you're smarter than all the rest of us.

Er, no.