health care
in [Golf]
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From: bknight on 10 Mar 2010 09:33 On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 07:58:42 -0500, BAR <screw(a)you.com> wrote: >In article <i3jcp5dsccn4ake2u7vil3j2bqiicpg10c(a)4ax.com>, >bknight(a)conramp.net says... >> You and Rob should hope that nothing like what Clark's, or John B's >> families experienced will never happen to yours. If it did I doubt >> that he would make political use of it here. > >Let's see, undiagnosed esophageal cancer, Colon cancer, Lymphoma, Breast >cancer requiring a radical bi-lateral mastectomy. And we, my sisters and >I, all have the genes that produce blood clots, got that from both >parents. And this is just my parents and siblings. If you want to talk >about Alzheimer's and the devastating effects that has on people lets >get started. No you idiot, let's NOT get started. I guarantee you that neither Clark nor John wilt make political hay out of your family's problems, nor be callous enough to suggest that you may have made mistakes in their treatment. > >Everyone's families experience hardships and setbacks. It's how you >choose to deal with them that is at issue. Singling out a specific >illness or diseases is just the desire of someone to sit on the pity- >potty for a while. Have you no shame???? Leave remarks about family out of these posts. BK
From: William Clark on 10 Mar 2010 09:42 In article <01bfp5lrgg2sdmnki7ns3htvo1hoaoc91p(a)4ax.com>, bknight(a)conramp.net wrote: > On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 07:58:42 -0500, BAR <screw(a)you.com> wrote: > > >In article <i3jcp5dsccn4ake2u7vil3j2bqiicpg10c(a)4ax.com>, > >bknight(a)conramp.net says... > > >> You and Rob should hope that nothing like what Clark's, or John B's > >> families experienced will never happen to yours. If it did I doubt > >> that he would make political use of it here. > > > >Let's see, undiagnosed esophageal cancer, Colon cancer, Lymphoma, Breast > >cancer requiring a radical bi-lateral mastectomy. And we, my sisters and > >I, all have the genes that produce blood clots, got that from both > >parents. And this is just my parents and siblings. If you want to talk > >about Alzheimer's and the devastating effects that has on people lets > >get started. > > No you idiot, let's NOT get started. I guarantee you that neither > Clark nor John wilt make political hay out of your family's problems, > nor be callous enough to suggest that you may have made mistakes in > their treatment. > > > >Everyone's families experience hardships and setbacks. It's how you > >choose to deal with them that is at issue. Singling out a specific > >illness or diseases is just the desire of someone to sit on the pity- > >potty for a while. > > Have you no shame???? Leave remarks about family out of these posts. > > BK It's OK - the filters are on for anything these zealots post.
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 10 Mar 2010 10:44 On Mar 9, 6:57 pm, Carbon <nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com> wrote: > On Tue, 09 Mar 2010 14:01:24 -0800, Dinosaur_Sr wrote: > > On Mar 9, 3:57 pm, "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> On Mar 8, 2:51 pm, Dinosaur_Sr <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > >>> Really? If I get ALS, I would want full time *CARE* in a care > >>> facility with expertise in the area. Someone to come and clean me up > >>> twice a day at home is pretty grim to me. "Home care" is > >>> substandard, cheapo care in cases like this, but it is where you > >>> have to go when the people have to support a useless, politicized > >>> govt bureaucracy and the cost of health care with the money they > >>> earn and spend on health care. FWIW, no need to support the > >>> insurance companies either, IMHO. If you can pay for a house or a > >>> car, you can pay for health care, and people who are too good to > >>> work can sleep in their own bed. > > >> I find it absolutely astounding that you would purport to lecture > >> William or me about ALS. He lost his father and I lost my mother to > >> it. Everything you've said here is bullshit. There is no such thing > >> as a full-time care facility with expertise in ALS. Home care is NOT > >> "cheapo," or substandard. You know absolutely nothing about this > >> disease, or about health care in general, and you'd be well-advised > >> to shut up about it. > > > Rubbish. I've seen the home care scam up front and personal. They push > > you out of the hospital ASAP, barely conscious in some instances. Home > > care is an excuse for cut rate care, and the emotional rubbish thrown > > out to support it indicates a cynical, almost evil lack of compassion > > by the system. > > How about you just admit that you have no idea about ALS care and we all > move on? I see, you have no reply to my post, so you make some unrelated comment. Enjoy your home care! You deserve it! And if you have to wait 8 hours for someone to come and empty your bedpan remember, it's what you wanted!
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 10 Mar 2010 10:48 On Mar 9, 8:06 pm, William Clark <wcla...(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com> wrote: > In article <p5idp5looaunc3gkv7la2sls5k4m02o...(a)4ax.com>, > > > > bkni...(a)conramp.net wrote: > > On Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:59:51 -0800 (PST), Dinosaur_Sr > > <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > <clip> > > >I am in no way sorry that I don't buy your sanctimonious BS. Some > > >nurse is just that. When one has a serious chronic, degenerative > > >disorder like ALS, a nurse is not qualified to deal with problems that > > >come up. You need a specialist MD, and if you don't know, and you > > >sound like you don't, ALS patients can have a variety of very serious > > >issues develop at any time. You need specialized, qualified people to > > >deal with this, and such care is in fact available in the US to > > >anyone...of course they have to pay for it...and if you have a problem > > >with that then perhaps you should lead the way by providing your > > >relatively worthless service free of charge! > > > <clip> > > > Good God Rob. How can you, with any degree of integrity, question a > > man who has had ALS in his family? How can you question a man's > > dedication to his father with such a disease? Do you not have a > > scintilla of embarrassment in being such a know-it-all? Are you > > aware that you come off as a callous prick? > > Easily (for him), easily again, no, and no. > > > > > In short, this is one of the typical Frostback situations where > > you're caught blowing wind and then attack the person who is much more > > qualified than you in a subject. It never flies. > > Next he will be telling us that he has published and attended > conferences in the field of ALS. Just wait. You are not qualified, so who is this other person who is more qualified? What you know about genetic disorders could be written on the head of a pin with a crayon.
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 10 Mar 2010 10:54
On Mar 9, 8:12 pm, William Clark <wcla...(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com> wrote: > In article > <75cc6758-8dde-4ab8-ac9e-4c311baa6...(a)j27g2000yqn.googlegroups.com>, > > > > Dinosaur_Sr <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > On Mar 9, 3:57 pm, "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > On Mar 8, 2:51 pm, Dinosaur_Sr <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > > > > On Mar 8, 9:45 am, William Clark <cl...(a)nospam.matsceng.ohio- > > > > > state.edu> wrote: > > > > > In article > > > > > <4ac95e14-5204-4e8b-ac45-42d73355c...(a)i25g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > Dinosaur_Sr <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > > > > > On Mar 7, 7:31 pm, William Clark <wcla...(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com> > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > In article > > > > > > > <768b0082-debe-40e1-9223-9ae266827...(a)a18g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>, > > > > > > > > Dinosaur Sr <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Mar 5, 3:40 pm, William Clark <cl...(a)nospam.matsceng.ohio- > > > > > > > > state.edu> wrote: > > > > > > > > > snippit.... > > > > > > > > > That's probably about the care you could get for $2 million in > > > > > > > > the UK > > > > > > > > I suppose. ALS is a degenerative disease that you can do little > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > (although there are some treatments that supposedly ameliorate > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > cell damage somewhat). > > > > > > > > Good thing you snipped all the details of the care provided for my > > > > > > > father, otherwise your lean-spirited little gibe would really show > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > up for the hypocrite you are. Please don't presume to patronize me > > > > > > > on > > > > > > > ALS - I have forgotten more about the disease than you will ever > > > > > > > know > > > > > > > about it. > > > > > > > > > Having someone visit from time to time, regardless of the > > > > > > > > interval, is > > > > > > > > not that big a deal. Providing the actual medical treatment in a > > > > > > > > modern facility is quite another. "Home based care" is one of the > > > > > > > > major ways those who think we want this plan to cut costs. Home > > > > > > > > appendectomy anyone? > > > > > > > > "Having someone visit from time to time" is nothing at all to do > > > > > > > with in > > > > > > > home nursing care, provided twice a day (and more often if > > > > > > > requested). > > > > > > > It has nothing to do with family doctors that pay house calls to > > > > > > > needy > > > > > > > patients. I am glad that you think that this whole ordeal is "not > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > big a deal". A less charitable soul than me would wish the same > > > > > > > fate > > > > > > > upon you, and then see how much you try to belittle the process and > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > care. > > > > > > > > The "home based care" that you sneer at (albeit in incomprehensible > > > > > > > syntax), was, in fact, the saving grace for my father and our > > > > > > > family. > > > > > > > None of us could bear thinking about having to move him out of his > > > > > > > home > > > > > > > into a hospice, as would have been the best outcome he could hope > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > here. However, I am also glad that you do finally admit that > > > > > > > providing > > > > > > > in home care is not only beneficial for the patient and family, but > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > also more efficient for the health service. Amen - you have just > > > > > > > taken > > > > > > > on board the principal argument for extending early and regular > > > > > > > health > > > > > > > care to those currently unable to afford it, and who will end up in > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > emergency rooms with chronic (and very expensive) illnesses. > > > > > > > Congratulations, and welcome to the side of reason. > > > > > > > Self righteous denigration? More of your Dr. Phil training there? > > > > > > Someone stopping by a couple of times a day isn't going to do much > > > > > > for > > > > > > an ALS victim. When they can take care of themselves, who needs > > > > > > it...when they can't, they need constant care. What would be really > > > > > > nice is to give them meds that ameliorate the condition. This would > > > > > > have to be done over their lifetime, and could prove quite costly, > > > > > > but > > > > > > some people might be willing to pay for it...but when the govt > > > > > > decides, it's going to be too expensive, isn't it? > > > > > > In your haste to be snide, you seem to forget that the name of the game > > > > > is health CARE. That includes curing illnesses AND caring for the sick, > > > > > even if their disease is incurable. I know you have a hard time > > > > > grasping > > > > > that concept, fixated as you are with who pays what for what, but do > > > > > try > > > > > a little harder. My father got all the medication that was available > > > > > for > > > > > this condition - the fact is that 20 years later, we still have made > > > > > little progress on ALS - and the health service paid for it all. So, > > > > > please try to get it into your head that this "socialized medicine" > > > > > that > > > > > you are so pathological about (even though you clearly know nothing > > > > > about it), provides BOTH medication and care, and cost is not an issue. > > > > > "Too expensive" ? Hell, no. > > > > > Really? If I get ALS, I would want full time *CARE* in a care facility > > > > with expertise in the area. Someone to come and clean me up twice a > > > > day at home is pretty grim to me. "Home care" is substandard, cheapo > > > > care in cases like this, but it is where you have to go when the > > > > people have to support a useless, politicized govt bureaucracy and the > > > > cost of health care with the money they earn and spend on health care. > > > > FWIW, no need to support the insurance companies either, IMHO. If you > > > > can pay for a house or a car, you can pay for health care, and people > > > > who are too good to work can sleep in their own bed. > > > > I find it absolutely astounding that you would purport to lecture > > > William or me about ALS. He lost his father and I lost my mother to > > > it. Everything you've said here is bullshit. There is no such thing as > > > a full-time care facility with expertise in ALS. Home care is NOT > > > "cheapo," or substandard. You know absolutely nothing about this > > > disease, or about health care in general, and you'd be well-advised to > > > shut up about it. > > > Rubbish. I've seen the home care scam up front and personal. They push > > you out of the hospital ASAP, barely conscious in some instances. Home > > care is an excuse for cut rate care, and the emotional rubbish thrown > > out to support it indicates a cynical, almost evil lack of compassion > > by the system. > > God almighty, you really are a lying lowlife. My father was bright and > fully alert right until the day he died. It would have killed his soul > to be cut off from his family and home, and stuck in the kind of > institution that you worship. As it was, he was at in the home he loved, > surrounded by family and constant visitors and well wishers - another > concept that I am sure is outside your experience. In addition, it would > have been a total waste of resources and money to keep him in a hospital > bed that he simply did not need or want. And you have the gall to call > the National Health service wasteful? Your hypocrisy knows no limits. > > There is only one "evil" in this discussion, and that is the evil within > you for your fellow man. God help you. You are a sanctimonious tool of the man. Give away all your rights and freedoms to the man in exchange for a promise of some sort of "care". I wish people like you could do this without harming the rights and freedoms of sensible people because it would be fun to sit back and watch you whine as you wallow in the mire of politicized entitlements. You think you are the only one who has had loved ones who needed medical care for serious disorders? Having access to specialized facilities is not a means that excludes contact with other people, family or whoever, it's just more costly. And for me, I'd rather have the option of spending my wealth to get the best healthcare I can as opposed to having some cut rate home care foisted on me by a cynical and uncaring overly politicized inept National Health Service. How much money the govt has to allocate to health care should have no impact on my health care when I have the resources to deal with such issues myself. |