From: BAR on
In article <wclark2-4E7388.20251711032010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-
state.edu>, wclark2(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com says...
>
> In article <MPG.260341b497ec20de989cd1(a)news.giganews.com>,
> BAR <screw(a)you.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <pi2ip55ht4biur73nmak9plni9g6n6rukk(a)4ax.com>,
> > bknight(a)conramp.net says...
> > > Common sense just flies right past your teeny little brain Bert.
> > >
> > > We don't want to read anyone's slurs about how another's family is
> > > cared for, and using that to push your political agenda.
> >
> > Clark using his family to push his political agenda is ok, however, when
> > someone calls him on it you jump all over them for pushing a political
> > agenda. Right Bobby, your hypocrisy and duplicity shines through again.
>
> No, I did not. I stated the facts of the case plain and simple, for
> intelligent people to consider. Obviously you are excluded from that
> group. It is you and Dino who have got your political knickers in a
> twist trying to discredit it for your own bigoted purposes.

You tried to push the NHS and your families experiences with it as a
model and it was thrown back in your face.
From: William Clark on
In article
<e228cbea-7a59-4e0d-a5f0-100ae87bff78(a)z11g2000yqz.googlegroups.com>,
Dinosaur_Sr <frostback(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote:

> On Mar 11, 2:52�pm, "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Mar 11, 2:07�pm, Dinosaur_Sr <frostb...(a)dukesofbiohazard.com>
>
> >
> > > You really want me to "educate" you on ALS? I can, you know!- Hide quoted
> > > text -
> >
> > > - Show quoted text -
> >
> > Sure, go ahead and make a fool of yourself, as if you haven't already.
>
> No problem!
>
> The symptoms of ALS are caused by oxidative damage to cells, at least
> in the classic sense. With the politics of disease these days, we have
> the Muscular Dystrophy people wanting MD to somehow be associated with
> ALS. Both are diseases caused by progressive cell damage and cell
> death, but totally different causes. ALS is caused by oxidative damage
> to cells. MD is caused by deficiencies in structural proteins in
> muscle cells.
>
> Classic ALS is superoxide dismutase deficiency, or SOD deficiency. SOD
> is an enzyme that degrades a molecule that will oxidize other
> molecules in your cell. Oxygen is, as we all know, toxic to your cells
> because it is a powerful oxidant, and the molecules in your cells,
> particularly proteins, are highly reduced. When oxygen, and molecules
> like superoxide, which do come to be in our cells for various reasons,
> are not processed properly, our cells suffer oxidative damage. Classic
> ALS is the accumulation of cell damage due to oxidative stress. People
> whose cells do not process oxidizing agents in their cells properly
> can suffer from diseases like ALS. SOD deficiency, the classic form of
> ALS, is a disease you are born with, and the cell damage accumulates
> over your life and will eventually kill you if you don't die of
> something else first. There are other enzymes involved in removing
> oxidizing agents in your cells, and if any of the genes for those
> enzymes are deficient, you could develop ALS. Of course your
> mitochondria are oxygen vacuum cleaners in your cells, and gobble up
> most of the oxygen that comes into your cells, but when your
> mitochondria don't work well, ALS would be a minor effect in most if
> not all cases!
>
> Why ALS though, essentially a degradation of peripheral nerves? The
> more metabolically active cells in your body will suffer damage from
> things like SOD deficiency first. Neurons are pretty much the most
> metabolically active cells in your body, and so the more metabolically
> active nerves will go first. You need peripheral nerves to do things
> like breath, and thus not being able to breath is a major cause of
> death for people with SOD deficiency (also a major cause of death for
> people with MD, but in the case of MD, it is the muscle cells that
> don't work).
>
> There are also multifactorial causes of ALS, more than one gene,
> interacting with environmental factors. Tough to pin down directly,
> but they are working on it.
>
> They have developed some treatments that can reduce oxidative damage
> to cells, but you have to take them pretty early on for any presumed
> effect. Once the symptoms develop, there is not much you can do. The
> damage is done, and hence the symptoms. But if you had the disease in
> your family history, you could be genetically tested and if you had
> some gene deficiency associated with ALS, you could begin some
> treatments. If it were me, I would.
>
> There is evidence of ALS brought on by environmental factors. I am
> personally somewhat suspicious of such claims, as they are usually
> associated with lawsuits. I don't see how some environmental cause
> could attack all your cells like that, or attack just peripheral
> neurons, but some of the arguments are compelling even if lacking in
> direct, empirical cause and effect evidence (as we all know,
> correlation is not indicative of causality!).
>
> Trying to be non technical, and I don't want to rant on too
> much...time to take the dogs for a walk anyways.
>
> There is a really nice textbook on genetic diseases out there called
> Thompson and Thompson, Genetics in Medicine, 7th edition (don't get
> anything prior to the 6th ed, revised, as they suck), a British book
> to boot, if you want to learn about genetic diseases. Anyone with a
> basic biology background should be able to handle it, which excludes
> you and Clark I suppose.

There we go - the plagiarized cut and paste we all expected.
From: Howard Brazee on
On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:03:44 -0800 (PST), Dinosaur_Sr
<frostback(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote:

>> The moronic witterings of one totally ignorant of their thesis - no
>> wonder you are not at a major university. You know, go get ALS, spend a
>> $1M on care for your selfish little self, and you will live not one day
>> longer. You family will be saddled with the cost for years to come,
>> however.
>
>It is far more selfish to expect other people to pay for it. You use
>your assets to pay for your health care. That's unselfish. Telling
>society at large they have to pay for you is beyond selfish, it's
>boorish and arrogant.

So which of us are you accusing? Those on Medicare?

I'd rather be honest in paying for medical care for the poor than to
pretend I don't do so. But not everybody values honesty.

--
"In no part of the constitution is more wisdom to be found,
than in the clause which confides the question of war or peace
to the legislature, and not to the executive department."

- James Madison
From: William Clark on
In article <rg8jp59g8ih06ba8p3jd2ttk04df92dko2(a)4ax.com>,
Howard Brazee <howard(a)brazee.net> wrote:

> On Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:03:44 -0800 (PST), Dinosaur_Sr
> <frostback(a)dukesofbiohazard.com> wrote:
>
> >> The moronic witterings of one totally ignorant of their thesis - no
> >> wonder you are not at a major university. You know, go get ALS, spend a
> >> $1M on care for your selfish little self, and you will live not one day
> >> longer. You family will be saddled with the cost for years to come,
> >> however.
> >
> >It is far more selfish to expect other people to pay for it. You use
> >your assets to pay for your health care. That's unselfish. Telling
> >society at large they have to pay for you is beyond selfish, it's
> >boorish and arrogant.
>
> So which of us are you accusing? Those on Medicare?
>
> I'd rather be honest in paying for medical care for the poor than to
> pretend I don't do so. But not everybody values honesty.

In truth, he doesn't have a clue who he is accusing. He has lost the
plot long ago.
From: William Clark on
In article <MPG.260364dc83a10b49989cd6(a)news.giganews.com>,
BAR <screw(a)you.com> wrote:

> In article <wclark2-4E7388.20251711032010(a)charm.magnus.acs.ohio-
> state.edu>, wclark2(a)colnospamumbus.rr.com says...
> >
> > In article <MPG.260341b497ec20de989cd1(a)news.giganews.com>,
> > BAR <screw(a)you.com> wrote:
> >
> > > In article <pi2ip55ht4biur73nmak9plni9g6n6rukk(a)4ax.com>,
> > > bknight(a)conramp.net says...
> > > > Common sense just flies right past your teeny little brain Bert.
> > > >
> > > > We don't want to read anyone's slurs about how another's family is
> > > > cared for, and using that to push your political agenda.
> > >
> > > Clark using his family to push his political agenda is ok, however, when
> > > someone calls him on it you jump all over them for pushing a political
> > > agenda. Right Bobby, your hypocrisy and duplicity shines through again.
> >
> > No, I did not. I stated the facts of the case plain and simple, for
> > intelligent people to consider. Obviously you are excluded from that
> > group. It is you and Dino who have got your political knickers in a
> > twist trying to discredit it for your own bigoted purposes.
>
> You tried to push the NHS and your families experiences with it as a
> model and it was thrown back in your face.

BS. I said what my family's experience was with the NHS, and numbnuts
like you, with absolutely zero data or knowledge to call on, just HAD to
try to shoot it down, because it gives the lie to your bigoted little
myth about health care.

Sorry, you lose again.