From: Jack Hollis on 21 Feb 2010 15:36
On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 11:31:57 -0700, Howard Brazee <howard(a)brazee.net>
>On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 21:16:02 -0500, Jack Hollis <xsleeper(a)aol.com>
>>>People under social security also buy private health insurance. And
>>>do. It doesn't mean they are willing to think about getting rid of
>>>their social security.
>>It's people on Medicare that have to buy supplemental insurance
>>because Medicare is inadequate.
>What they buy isn't insurance though. It doesn't pay for disasters,
>it pays for deductibles.
There are a number of Medicare Supplemental Insurance plans that you
can buy to cover things that are not covered by basic Medicare. This
is also known as Medigap, which is insurance purchased from a private
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 21 Feb 2010 15:37
On Feb 19, 8:57 am, "John B." <johnb...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 19, 7:12 am, BAR <sc...(a)you.com> wrote:
> > In article <4b7de8c5$0$4967$9a6e1...(a)unlimited.newshosting.com>,
> > nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com says...
> > > On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 19:30:41 -0500, BAR wrote:
> > > > In article <4b7dcb52$0$27203$9a6e1...(a)unlimited.newshosting.com>,
> > > > nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com says...
> > > >> On Thu, 18 Feb 2010 08:24:00 -0800, John B. wrote:
> > > >>> I don't wany my access to all the above to be dependent on my
> > > >>> employment and how much my employer is willing to spend on health
> > > >>> insurance. If I were to lose my job, I wouldn't be able to afford
> > > >>> the medications I depend on. If I were to sell my house and take my
> > > >>> kids out of college so I could afford to buy my own insurance
> > > >>> policy, it wouldn't cover my meds because they would be deemed to be
> > > >>> for a pre- existing condition. What's your solution to that, Bert?
> > > >> Don't get sick. And if you do, die quickly.
> > > > Access to health care is not dependent upon employment.
> > > > If you were better at negotiating pay with your employer and you did a
> > > > better job saving money you would have enough money to pay for your
> > > > health care. Instead you have abdicated your personal responsibility
> > > > to someone else which has made you dependent upon their generosity and
> > > > goodwill.
> > > > When the teat is taken away you are lost and can't figure out where
> > > > your next meal is coming from.
> > > Thank you, but I've heard all this clueless propaganda before. I am in
> > > favor of universal healthcare because it is cheaper and more humane. You
> > > obviously do not know the first thing about it, and yet you are positive
> > > that you're right.
> > If you want Universal Health Care there are many countries around the
> > world that offer it and there is no one stopping you from emigrating to
> > any of them except you.- Hide quoted text -
> > - Show quoted text -
> Every industrialized country on earth offers universal health care
> except the U.S., yet the U.S. is the only one of them that's embroiled
> in a debate about health care.
Where has all the innovation and improvement in health care come from
over this period?
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 21 Feb 2010 15:39
On Feb 19, 3:27 pm, "gray asphalt" <dontwr...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> "Dinosaur_Sr" <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote in message
> On Feb 17, 8:30 pm, "gray asphalt" <dontwr...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > "Dinosaur_Sr" <frostback2...(a)att.net> wrote in message
> > On Feb 17, 5:00 pm, "gray asphalt" <dontwr...(a)gmail.com> wrote:
> > > "dene" <d...(a)remove.ipns.com> wrote in message
> > >news:7u300eFgdqU1(a)mid.individual.net...
> > > > "gray asphalt" <dontwr...(a)gmail.com> wrote in message
> > > >news:d7Xen.8$Ee1.4(a)newsfe12.iad...
> > > >> "dene" <d...(a)remove.ipns.com> wrote in message
> > > >>news:7tnb50Fs8nU1(a)mid.individual.net...
> > > >> > "Carbon" <nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
> > > >> >news:4b75e854$0$21064$9a6e19ea(a)unlimited.newshosting.com...
> > > >> >> On Fri, 12 Feb 2010 07:27:03 -0500, BAR wrote:
> > > >> >> > In article <oy0dn.144819$kQ5.41...(a)newsfe08.iad>,
> > > >> >> > dontwr...(a)gmail.com
> > > >> >> Great! I'd like healthcare that covers me for every possible
> > > >> >> illness
> > > >> >> with no upfront co-pays at less than 2/3 of what I'm paying now,
> > > >> >> with
> > > > no
> > > >> >> exclusions for pre-existing conditions and where the insurance
> > > >> >> company
> > > >> >> can never drop coverage. In return I will agree to Tort reform,
> > > >> >> such
> > > >> >> that I will never expect an honest mistake to be equivalent to
> > > >> >> winning
> > > >> >> the lottery.
> > > >> > Yeah....liberals are great at spending other people's money.
> > > >> > -Greg
> > > >> And banks, tobacco companies, auto manufacturers,
> > > >> health insurance companies, oil companies, mortgage
> > > >> companies, defense industry ... campanies are great at
> > > >> stealing other people's money. Where's my list? Did I
> > > >> forget anyone? How about fructose companies ... security
> > > >> companies ala Blackwater, wall street in general ...
> > > >> Oh yeah, Madison Avenue, who has created synicism
> > > >> and deep rooted fear in the basic honesty of the American
> > > >> people, especially in children who watch false adverstising...
> > > >> Did I forget media in general?
> > > > All the ones you mention are ultimately accountable to the consumer..
> > > > You
> > > > have the choice whether you want to do business with them. Do you have
> > > > that
> > > > choice with your taxes? Who is government accountable to? If you think
> > > > the
> > > > voters, then consider why the government is growing 5% while business
> > > > and
> > > > personal revenues are stagnant or shrinking.
> > > > -Greg
> > > And the people who died in Bopol, India from Union
> > > Carbide are going to stop doing business. I guess. And
> > > the people who died in Ford Pintos, yeah they will stop
> > > doing business with Ford. And the thousands of people
> > > who die every year in hospitals from malpractice are
> > > definitely going to go somewhere in the next life. Them
> > > stupid people who expect for the government to protect
> > > them from innocent buisnesses ... And I'm pretty sure the
> > > people who were suckered into bad loans will not
> > > finance with the same companies ... well not for a few
> > > years after they partially recover from bankruptcy.
> > > Yep, the American dream. Cheat your neighbors. up with
> > > corporations, lobby the government, unrestricted spending
> > > by coprs on political ads. It's the government's fault, not
> > > the corporations who own the government.
> > The millions of people in the Soviet Union who died because the govt
> > took all the grain to Moscow and left them with nothing. The millions
> > murdered by the Khmer Rouges because they weren't the right "kind" of
> > people. How about all the people who died building Moscow's marvelous
> > subway! Govt control! The solution to all our problems!
> > _____
> > No offense buy I'm kinda focused on US government.
> Oh yeah ... and I suppose "manifest destiny"
> was an excuse for imperialism. I'm sure the
> Mexicans weren't bothered at all by the theft of
> Texas, and how much other land?
> So your arguement is that since government is
> bad, bug business is good? And allowing big
> business to dictate to government is a good
> I'll go with Ross Perot on these issues. Remember
> him, the guy who critisized General Motors for
> their hubris and unwillingness to adapt and their
> lack of concern for workers ... Well Gm certainly
> has prospered and if they could just get government
> to take back the bailout money, they'd be even better.
There is no check on government. When they take over, the system
becomes purely political. Big business cannot dictate to govt, but
govt can dictate to big business.
How 'bout that Toyota?
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 21 Feb 2010 15:45
On Feb 20, 10:39 am, Carbon <nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 08:03:44 -0500, BAR wrote:
> > In article <hvCfn.818$BD2....(a)newsfe14.iad>, dontwr...(a)gmail.com
> > says...
> >> Oh yeah ... and I suppose "manifest destiny" was an excuse for
> >> imperialism. I'm sure the Mexicans weren't bothered at all by the
> >> theft of Texas, and how much other land?
> > War or the threat of war has determined the political and national
> > boundaries of kingdoms and countries.
> > One of the penalties of losing armed conflict is that your military
> > will may be destroyed and you may lose some or all of your territory.
> Ok, here's a possible future scenario. The US dollar continues to
> decline until it becomes nearly worthless in international trade. Cut
> off from world markets, the economy collapses. Unemployment skyrockets.
> There is widespread civil unrest. Foreign interests come in with their
> stronger currencies and buy up everything worth having. At that point
> the country will have been effectively taken over by foreign interests.
> Say this actually happens. Will you still be sharing your smug little
> stories about the survival of the fittest? What if you're the one on the
> losing end?
This will happen at some point, as it did the the UK in the early to
mid 20th century. If Americans continue to spend so excessively, it
will happen a lot sooner. As China, India, Brazil and others continue
to grow, they will have more and more fiscal power. As we fall into
the category of self absorbed, seal entitled deadbeats we will
decline. There is no free health care, no free housing and no free
lunch. FWIW, IMHO western Europe is totally done, but they don't know
it yet. They have no capacity to recover from this crisis. They
consume much and produce next to nothing.
From: Dinosaur_Sr on 21 Feb 2010 15:47
On Feb 20, 12:33 pm, Carbon <nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 11:57:59 -0500, BAR wrote:
> > In article <4b800fe6$0$4861$9a6e1...(a)unlimited.newshosting.com>,
> > nob...(a)nospam.tampabay.rr.com says...
> >> On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 11:25:27 -0500, BAR wrote:
> >>> I am horrified that anyone gets anything for free except the air
> >>> they breath. The only way someone gets something for free is that
> >>> something has to be taken from someone else.
> >> You fool, you're already paying for them in higher insurance
> >> premiums.
> > And you believe that giving them free health care, which they already
> > have, is going to change what I am paying? You are the fool.
> > What I want is for them to get jobs and pay for their own health care.
> > This will cause my health care costs to go down.
> > There is a parallel. Those who receive free health care are like
> > shoplifters. They cause the price of all of the other good to rise.
> > Stop the shoplifting and the prices go down.
> > What are shoplifters prosecuted for stealing and people stealing
> > health care services not prosecuted?
> Here's a parallel that makes sense. The war on healthcare is a lot like
> the so-called war on drugs. The US has spent trillions of dollars over
> the years incarcerating a higher percentage of its population than any
> other first world country. And for what? For a drug problem is at least
> as bad here as in countries like Denmark, where you can get pretty much
> any drug you want without fear of going to jail. The whole thing is a
> ridiculous waste of money and has been for the past 40 years at least.
> Year in and year out, Americans pay more for healthcare per capita than
> citizens of any other first world country, thanks in no small part to a
> massive bureaucracy designed to weed out the unentitled. The joke is
> that it costs more to run than just giving healthcare to the poor to
> start with. Like the war on drugs, the war on healthcare is an
> ill-considered policy that has always done much more harm than good.
Nothing wrong with making drugs illegal, as long as I don't have to
pay for the inability of drug users to get a job! ...stolen from Ann
Keith Olbermann is a girl!