Illegal alien rights in the U.S.
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From: dene on 18 May 2010 01:26 "Alan Baker" <alangbaker(a)telus.net> wrote in message news:alangbaker-C8838C.20334217052010(a)news.shawcable.com... > In article <85efb6Fr62U1(a)mid.individual.net>, > "dene" <dene(a)remove.ipns.com> wrote: > > > "Alan Baker" <alangbaker(a)telus.net> wrote in message > > news:alangbaker-50A5D8.19451217052010(a)news.shawcable.com... > > > In article <85e7i3FmpbU1(a)mid.individual.net>, > > > > > > > > > > God also claims to know people after their deaths. Does that make dead > > > > > people alive? > > > > > > > > What do you care? You claim to be an atheist. > > > > > > > > -Greg > > > > > > I care in so far as you claim your morals are rooted in it and that > > > abortion is immoral because it is the taking of a human life. > > > > > > I'm actually not surprised that you need to have this explained to you. > > > > Baloney. If I thought you were sincere about this question or any other > > one, I'd take the time to respond. > > I am sincere insofar as we are discussing your moral basis for opposing > abortion. It's been stated. Google it, troll. -Greg
From: Strabo on 18 May 2010 03:39 Howard Brazee wrote: > On Sat, 15 May 2010 14:02:31 -0400, Strabo <strabo(a)flashlight.net> > wrote: > >>>> Illegal aliens do not have unalienable rights. >>> We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created >>> equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable >>> Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of >>> Happiness. >>> >> I commend any foreign national who understands the import of Jefferson's >> words, but the US Declaration is not to be confused with constitutional >> or statutory law. > > The Constitution doesn't mention unalienable rights. I don't happen > to believe rights can be unalienable, but when the expression is used, > I look at the one place I know it exists. If you have a more > applicable source for that phrase, by all means share it. > "Unalienable Rights" comes from the Declaration, a founding document, "...endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness...." Amendments 1 through 10 of the federal constitution, the Bill of Rights, are some of the aforementioned unalienable rights. That the SCOTUS has misread these Rights and Congress has misapplied law compromising these Rights, does not detract from their meaning or intent. Additionally, each of the original state constitutions contained versions of the Bill of Rights and most retain them today. What is a Right? This is demonstrated by the Rule of Rights, "A Right is an action or actions by one individual which do NOT infringe on another individual's Rights OR place an obligation on that individual." In other words: 1. You can do anything which does not prevent another person from exercising his rights; 2. You can do do anything which does NOT obligate another person. You have the right to your opinion but you do not have a right to force a newspaper to publish it. You have a right to medical care but you do not have the right to force others to provide it. > >> Foreign nationals are granted certain privileges under US law but >> these are not to be confused with unalienable rights which apply to >> citizens. >
From: Strabo on 18 May 2010 03:43 Mr.Sandman wrote: > Strabo wrote: >> Howard Brazee wrote: >>> On Thu, 13 May 2010 23:47:43 -0400, Strabo <strabo(a)flashlight.net> >>> wrote: >>> >>>>> We've all broken laws. But our justice system assumes we are >>>>> innocent until found guilty. >>>>> >>>> Maybe it's about how you define "we". >>> >>> You and me and anybody else. >>> >>>> If one is within the US and is not demonstrably a citizen of the US, >>>> and one does not have papers authorizing his presence, then one is a >>>> foreign national. >>> >>> How do you demonstrate that you are a citizen of the U.S.? Do you >>> carry a birth certificate with you? >>> >>>> Does a Frenchman have 5th A. rights? Germans? Brazilians? Mexicans? >>> >>> Yes. >>> >>>> If one is an illegal alien the 5th A. does not apply. >>> >>> If you are accused of a crime, the 5th amendment applies - even if >>> that accusation is that you are an illegal alien. Your accent sounds >>> vaguely Canadian to me. >>> >>>> Illegal aliens do not have unalienable rights. >>> >>> We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created >>> equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable >>> Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of >>> Happiness. >>> >> >> I commend any foreign national who understands the import of Jefferson's >> words, but the US Declaration is not to be confused with constitutional >> or statutory law. >> >> Foreign nationals are granted certain privileges under US law but >> these are not to be confused with unalienable rights which apply to >> citizens. > > You need to study moral philosophy. Citizens and slaves have the right > to Life, Liberty and pursuit of Happiness for no other reason than being > Human. > > That is why slavery is morally wrong. > That's nice. Illegal aliens still do not have unalienable rights. In fact, no other government or legal system on the planet is structured to accommodate unalienable rights. >> >> >>
From: Strabo on 18 May 2010 04:03 Alan Baker wrote: > In article <YjBHn.10166$jt.2336(a)newsfe04.iad>, > Strabo <strabo(a)flashlight.net> wrote: > >> Howard Brazee wrote: >>> On Thu, 13 May 2010 23:47:43 -0400, Strabo <strabo(a)flashlight.net> >>> wrote: >>> >>>>> We've all broken laws. But our justice system assumes we are >>>>> innocent until found guilty. >>>>> >>>> Maybe it's about how you define "we". >>> You and me and anybody else. >>> >>>> If one is within the US and is not demonstrably a citizen of the US, >>>> and one does not have papers authorizing his presence, then one is a >>>> foreign national. >>> How do you demonstrate that you are a citizen of the U.S.? Do you >>> carry a birth certificate with you? >>> >>>> Does a Frenchman have 5th A. rights? Germans? Brazilians? Mexicans? >>> Yes. >>> >>>> If one is an illegal alien the 5th A. does not apply. >>> If you are accused of a crime, the 5th amendment applies - even if >>> that accusation is that you are an illegal alien. Your accent sounds >>> vaguely Canadian to me. >>> >>>> Illegal aliens do not have unalienable rights. >>> We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created >>> equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable >>> Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of >>> Happiness. >>> >> I commend any foreign national who understands the import of Jefferson's >> words, but the US Declaration is not to be confused with constitutional >> or statutory law. >> >> Foreign nationals are granted certain privileges under US law but >> these are not to be confused with unalienable rights which apply to >> citizens. > > Rights according to the founding principles of the United States apply > to everyone because they are granted by a creator with a higher power > than the United States. > Yes. > > Furthermore, the Declaration of Independence makes it clear that the > writers believed those rights existed even prior to that document let > alone the formation of the United States. > Yes, Organic and Natural law. > > How can they have existed if they "only apply to citizens" of something > which did not yet exist? > 1. The exercise of unalienable Rights in this instance is a legal and not a moral matter. 2. Foreign nationals are by treaty and international law subject to the laws of their respective native countries. 3. An illegal alien is an undocumented foreign national and has no standing under US law. He must thus be ousted ASAP lest confusion occur such as that exemplified by posters in this NG. 4. The presence of a foreign national within an alien sovereign territory creates a quandary. Therefore foreign nationals must be documented in order to satisfy legal jurisdictions.
From: Strabo on 18 May 2010 04:16
Mr.Sandman wrote: > Strabo wrote: >> Mr.Sandman wrote: >>> Strabo the idiot wrote: >>> <snipped> > Incoherent bullshit. That paragraph contradicts the previous one. > You're still trying to wiggle your way out of this. > You cannot kill or maim someone for being an illegal migrant. Their > offense does not rise to the level where you can do that. > Being in the country without proper documentation is a misdemeanor. >> >> Is this a paradox? Not at all. >> >> 1. Illegal aliens are not at liberty to exercise their unalienable >> rights because they drew first blood by infringing upon the >> rights of Americans. >> >> 2. Their status as illegals constitutes a clear and present danger >> to American life and property. >> >> But you know that. Well, you don't really know it but you suspect >> there's some significance to "rights." >> >> I'm glad to see so many assume that the US Declaration pertains to >> non-Americans. Maybe they'll overthrow their governments and do it right >> next time. But for the time being, documented foreign nationals are >> subject to treaty and their nation's laws. > > What a stupid thing to say. All men have inalienable rights, not just > U.S citizens. > You cannot enslave anyone even if they are not citizens. > Try this... I'm going to exercise my Right to buy a handgun today. Is our illegal alien going to exercise his right? No. Because he has no such right. To exercise such a right would require that someone break the law. Technically, no undocumented alien may transact or enter into a legal contract. The cars, houses, bank accounts, all these things that illegal aliens have done in recent years, are illegal and those who accommodated them are guilty of aiding and abetting. |